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BMX General => BMX Chat => Topic started by: SaMAlex on January 17, 2013, 11:21 AM
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I was talking to Johann yesterday and today about which was the first BMX frame to come with brake lugs (U-brake I guess, but canti lugs might make a good parallel question).
I know that GT and Haro were both doing U-brakes on frames in the mid-to-late 80s (and they both stopped putting them on frames in the early 90s). And there was also a whole wave of people doing it again in the early 90s.
Johann remembers seeing photos of an early Street Beat (proto?) that had brake lugs.
Anyone got any suggestions?
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Oh, Ive found a photo of a Street Beat with brake lugs. I dont know much about Street Beats but I think this is a later frame, right?
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/r313/alexleech/sb86.jpg)
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I nicked this off Owen William's facebook, he saw it in a shop window in London a while back. It looks like an 85/86
Alex has just made a good point
"That one defo looks factory fit, what with all the cable guides. All the other pics that came up on google search didnt have mounts. Im also sure I saw them on a real early Vander prototype frame."
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/jj175/emerbmx/559234_10150622613857967_1511698090_n_zps721ac902.jpg)
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Torker were at it in 86 with the 540 air
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Torker were at it in 86 with the 540 air
Good call - wasn't expecting that
Are we allowed to put museum links here? There's an 86 on the museum
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The white and red Beats were out in 86 :daumenhoch:
These ones were out in 88 :daumenhoch:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/r313/alexleech/sb86.jpg)
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I think that white/red one in the window has a cable guide under the downtube. Half way along at the end of the white part. So I guess that might make the skyway and the Torker both 1986.
What year were the Haro Sports with the 990s on the top of the chainstay?
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Thanks Pickle.
It's unusual as I've not seen another 86 Street beat with lugs and don't appear to be able to find another online. I'm guessing this was a small production run, rather than a one off, anyone clarify?
The Sports with lugs were 87
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The earliest frames I can remember with lugs would be a haro sport or group 1, 1988? Or a dyno compe/pro compe
What about mongoose decades? They had u-brake lugs under the chainstays didn't they? 1987??
I don't remember GT's having lugs that early, my '91 aggressor needed a trip to the welders after I got fed up with a pitbull.
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the original Decades used the shimano centre pull brake, not 990's as far as i know.
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Thanks Pickle.
It's unusual as I've not seen another 86 Street beat with lugs and don't appear to be able to find another online. I'm guessing this was a small production run, rather than a one off, anyone clarify?
The Sports with lugs were 87
the serial number on mine says 85 but they came out in 86
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/b339/robertbransby/20121111_094208.jpg)
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the original Decades used the shimano centre pull brake, not 990's as far as i know.
Ahh right. It's a shady memory, I just remember the brake being down below on my mate's decade. It seemed "futuristic" at the time.. ;D
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I don't remember GT's having lugs that early, my '91 aggressor needed a trip to the welders after I got fed up with a pitbull.
The late 80s performers had 990s (is the one in this pic an 87?)
I heard that in the early 90s GT stopped putting Brake mounts on bikes because "kids" were having problems setting up U-brakes.
Sidepull brakes gave their bike shops much less problems. :idiot2:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/r313/alexleech/87Performer.jpg)
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The Sports with lugs were 87
Just so we got pics of them all, here are the 1987 Haro Sport and Master.
It is beginning to look like 87 was the year that brake mounts started (even if Haro and GT stopped using them for a while)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/r313/alexleech/framesets87.jpg)
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Yes I remeber that GT now, thet were the ones that came in neon pink weren't they?
Did the U-brake come from mtb's? I had a peugeot mtb in the very late 80's that had a shimano rear u-brake but this thread suggests that u-brakes had been around for a couple of years by then...
So come on then, who made the first u-brake? And for which specific bike??
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Did the U-brake come from mtb's?
Yeah, early MTBs had Canti brakes but some also came with U-brakes on the rear. Often on the Chain stays. I think that late early Muddy Foxes and also Sarasen's had them. Some Sarasens even had front and rear U-brakes
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The one and only bike other than a BMX I've owned was a Saracen in the 80's - that had U-brakes rear, canti's front.
There, I went and admitted I've owned a mountain bike.
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Oh, and those GT MTBs with the funny seat stays and extra triangle .... they had rear U-brakes. That was late 80s at least.
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Yeah - think my Saracen was '87? Them triple triangle GT's were around in 87/88 I think?
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I think the first, white painted Muddy Foxes had Canti front and rear. It was the later ones (that had a Yellow Explorer) that had the U-brakes (I was working in a bike shop when they came out). I'd believe that was 87 ish. It's looking like U-brakes (Dia Compe 990s, or Shimano) started to be on MTBs and BMXs in 1987.
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This was the first MTB I saw with a u-brake. I think they were out in 88, so a bit after BMXs were using them :-\
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/r313/alexleech/muddyfox88explorer_88.jpg)
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I think the Scorpian breakdancer had 2 rear brakes- an extra rear U brake? As well as the rear caliper, both were bolt on though.
BMX Action did a feature on a BMX with Cantis, or rollercams in 83/84, but they were also bolt on.
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Thats really interesting Johann, thanks for bring those up. Next time someone ask about the first Bolt-on center-pull brakes, then you'll be spot on topic.
Shame its no use at all on this WELDED ON BRAKE LUGS thread!!! :tickedoff: :LolLolLolLol:
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I'm thinking early '87, didn't really make My brakes any better with Tuffs though until I figured out how to set them up :LolLolLolLol:
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This was the first MTB I saw with a u-brake. I think they were out in 88, so a bit after BMXs were using them :-\
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/r313/alexleech/muddyfox88explorer_88.jpg)
Thats really interesting Alex, thanks for bringing this up. Next time there's a subject of U brakes on MTBs, then you'll be spot on forums. What is this RADMTB.co.uk :LolLolLolLol:
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I'd like to publicly apologise for getting over excited and trying to tell you about bolt on centre pull brakes when it has nothing to do with welded on brake lugs. :D With that out the way-
86 Torker and 86 Street beat are currently the earliest examples of BMX frames with brake lugs?
Any one know which one was first or if there's anything earlier?
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I thought there were earlier bmx's that had mounts with Suntour Cunningham roller cams. Not a u brake but still used frame mounts. :daumenhoch:
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I thought there were earlier bmx's that had mounts with Suntour Cunningham roller cams. Not a u brake but still used frame mounts. :daumenhoch:
Mongoose had 'em on their ATB's in 1985. And I'm guessing but if the Roller cam came out 82ish, then welded lugs on ATB's might have appeared around '83?
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Ammaco issued myself and glyn lewis with prototype frames at the end of 85 they had lugs on the underside of the chainstays and also on the forks, I hadn't seen them before so I took it to a local road bike shop but they didn't have any brakes to fit.
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I thought there were earlier bmx's that had mounts with Suntour Cunningham roller cams. Not a u brake but still used frame mounts. :daumenhoch:
Yeah, good point. Didnt Hutch have a weld-on mount Roller cam front brake?
The same one that Standard had on a few prototype forks in the 90s.
Ammaco issued myself and glyn lewis with prototype frames at the end of 85 they had lugs on the underside of the chainstays and also on the forks, I hadn't seen them before so I took it to a local road bike shop but they didn't have any brakes to fit.
Thats way cool, very interesting. Strange that Ammaco would put mounts on when the brakes werent really available. I wonder where they got the details of the mounts and the idea to use them. Esp as not many (if any) other bikes were using them in 1985
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I thought there were earlier bmx's that had mounts with Suntour Cunningham roller cams. Not a u brake but still used frame mounts. :daumenhoch:
Yeah, good point. Didnt Hutch have a weld-on mount Roller cam front brake?
The same one that Standard had on a few prototype forks in the 90s.
Ammaco issued myself and glyn lewis with prototype frames at the end of 85 they had lugs on the underside of the chainstays and also on the forks, I hadn't seen them before so I took it to a local road bike shop but they didn't have any brakes to fit.
Thats way cool, very interesting. Strange that Ammaco would put mounts on when the brakes werent really available. I wonder where they got the details of the mounts and the idea to use them. Esp as not many (if any) other bikes were using them in 1985
I dont think ammaco had a clue about the lugs tbh, the frames were a bit of a mystery they said It was a prototype but I suspect they were catalogue frames from usual supplier in Taiwan. I was breaking the ammaco all steel 18" frame on a weekly basis and they had to send me a complete every time so they said they would get me a stronger full chro-mo frame and the frame with the lugs is what turned up. The frames had similarities to the ammaco styler500 such as the kicktail etc which was introduced a while later so I suspect manufactured in same place.
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Diamond back had lugged frames in 86 but i dont think they are ad 990 , i thought they also did a reactor race bike at the same time ,
http://bmxmuseum.com/bikes/diamondback/56394
http://bmxmuseum.com/bikes/diamondback/50224
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Good digging bof and a very interesting story from S&Mc. So who made those lugged ammaco frames? Were they definitely Japanese?
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skyway didn't put luggs on 'beats until '87
bet they just used old beats up first +welded the luggs on :-\
http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee101/99bowtie/IMG_3141.jpg
sure it was the diamondback with mike d strike zone in '86 -remember bmx plus having a test with one