RADBMX.CO.UK
Technical & Reference Section => Tech and Restoration => Topic started by: laidback on September 29, 2013, 10:14 PM
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Evening all,
I thought i'd pick your brains/get opinions on restoring my 48's.
The front is pretty true, the hub's in good nick and will polish up well, as i think will the spokes. My LBS will true this up and the guy mentioned that i could keep the original spokes, but the nipples might need replacing. Not sure whether to go the whole hog or not!
I was thinking about stainless spokes and nipples, or maybe some coloured (black maybe) anodised nipples?
How much should i be looking at for a wheel re-lace? i'm new to this
Any thoughts/advice?
Front:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2120_zps1ec3dc43.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2120_zps1ec3dc43.jpg.html)
Unfortunately the rear rim was dented beyond repair, but a friend has sourced a used replacement for me, however both rims (Front and rear) need work.. they have scratches and nicks all over them:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2121_zps6302bb1c.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2121_zps6302bb1c.jpg.html)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2122_zpsa4744c39.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2122_zpsa4744c39.jpg.html)
I was thinking about polishing these out with fine wet and dry paper, then using autosol on the rim to finish it. Is this a good idea, or are they not worth it/is there a better method?
Id obviously be removing the anodising, so will i forever be polishing them?
If i have the cash, i will look at replacement decals too, anyone know of someone producing these?
Thanks for reading, hope you guys can guide me in the right direction!
:daumenhoch:
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Wet and dry the edges, stainless spokes with silver nipples to stop rusting spokes in six months time, and peregrine decals from del, make sure you ask for the early type. :daumenhoch:
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Thanks for the reply. I tried to go on Dels website, doesn't seem to be working. Shall i just PM him on here, or does he have a thread to post in?
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Just pm him on here. :daumenhoch:
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My LBS charges £16 a wheel for a build.
I build me own - you should give it a go - it's easier than it looks, rewarding and there's a handy guide here:
http://www.radbmx.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1344.0.html
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I did a step by step guide on wheel restoring some time back. Search my name it should still be on here. :daumenhoch:
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Thanks for the reply's guys.
I found a spoke key, so i'll probably have a go at dismantling/rebuilding one and see how i get on ;D
I had a practice polish today, started with 240 grit wet and dry and worked up to 1500, finished with Autosol. Here's the results:
Before:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/image_zps61ab8f8b.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/image_zps61ab8f8b.jpg.html)
After:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/image_zpsc8dd041d.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/image_zpsc8dd041d.jpg.html)
Not bad for a quick job, long way to go before i get a mirror finish!
I'm currently debating whether to do the whole hoop, including the flat part where the lettering etc is, whilst the wheels apart. Thoughts?
Also, should i be using a block, as i have just been using wet and dry in my fingers...will this method make the surface of the rim uneven?
Cheers :daumenhoch:
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Always use a block, using wet and dry will not make the surface uneven enough for u to notice. But "bump" the block will give u a more consistent finish.
U will need a buffer really to get a mirror finish.
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or better still sell them to me as they are and save you messing with em :angel:
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Good start mate, keep us updated how it goes... I've got some to do as well. :daumenhoch:
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doubt if you want to rebuild with same spokes so save a lot of hassle by cutting the spokes out with an angle grinder ... job done in seconds :-)
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Well as it was pretty miserable outside today, i set about stripping the 48's. I've arranged to borrow Animals wheels straightening kit too, so fingers crossed i can save the rear rim.
I separated the spokes into 'innies and outies' as i wasnt sure whether they'd be different lengths...Does anyone know if i'll need to order two lengths of spokes to build the wheels? haven't measured them yet.
Another question...When i replace the spoked and nipples, does anyone know what length/guage i need, and the best place to order them from?
The fruits of my labour:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2490_zps8cf47b4f.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2490_zps8cf47b4f.jpg.html)
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Measure the old spokes from the bend to the end of the thread and that will give u your size. ;)
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Wait for another rainy day and have a go at building your own wheel? If you've an old wheel, take it apart and try and put it back together? I build my own wheels, I have all the tools now (jig and spoke threader) and I taught myself on a rainy day too, with a few youtube video's.
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The plan is to attempt to build these myself :daumenhoch: I just need to order the spokes and nipples and do some work on the hoops.
Have any of you chaps got any suggestions for where to buy the spokes? still considering the Black nipples to break up the silver/tie in with the decals.
I polished up the front hub tonight with various grades of wet and dry and autosol...
Before:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2498_zpsb3360a1f.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2498_zpsb3360a1f.jpg.html)
After:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2499_zpsf6da8b76.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2499_zpsf6da8b76.jpg.html)
quite pleased with that. Was supposed to be off out for a few beers, but got sidetracked! :loser: ;D
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Nice job of the polishing! Thats turned out pretty damn sweet! From what I remember youre gonna need 184mm spokes but dont take my word for it. There's a thread on the museum that has loads and loads of spoke sizes for various rim/hub applications if you cant measure your own....do a searchy and thee will find :).
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well, whilst the mrs was out at the cinema, i cracked open a beer and polished up the rear hub. Getting quite good at this polishing malarky. I hope the rims turn out nearly as nice.
Quick newbie question- are these hubs classed as 'high flange' hubs? i'm guessing they are?...
Results:
Before:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2507_zpsc389f915.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2507_zpsc389f915.jpg.html)
After:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2508_zps81b3e49e.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2508_zps81b3e49e.jpg.html)
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:daumenhoch: Look good! I got pair of hp48 ready for rebuild too. This thread will give me the idea for winter project! Thanks for sharing!!! :daumenhoch:
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Afternoon all,
Well I've done a bit more on these recently. Having read Sids resto guide, I gave them a bath in Caustic Soda to remove the anodising:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsde6a122e.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsde6a122e.jpg.html)x
Now this is stripped I have noticed some pitting on the brake surface of the rim. I think this may have been caused by the caustic soda:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsc2c11194.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsc2c11194.jpg.html)
Slightly annoying...I'm guessing the only way to remove
These is to use course sandpaper and work my way back up whilst polishing? Just wondering if anyone else has experienced this and how they got rid of the marks?
Seems like a lot of hassle! I guess they'll be worth it in the end!
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just out of interest did the rims discolor after the caustic bath either brown or black ?
i take it you dipped em after you rubbed down the brake surface , seems unusual to get pitting on an already flatted off surface , bare alloy will discolor almost straight away in caustic and the anno finish should dissolve long before pitting starts, you should be left with a smooth surface under the discoloration that will polish up by hand pretty well.
some one might know if hp rims were hard anno?
if that's the case then some hard anno will not come of with caustic you have to use abrasive to get it off before a caustic/ acidic clean, or have em re anodized professionally
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They didn't discolour greatly. They were in the solution for about an hour, turned
Every 10 mins or so. I rubbed down a section of one rim before I dipped
Them, so they weren't completely bare aluminium.
I wonder if the solution was too strong/I left them in for too long, hence the pitting.
I'll attack them with some 80 grit and see what happens, it's the only way i can see to get rid of the pitting.
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been in the solution to long i'm affraid,week solution for a long time will produce the pitting ,
your better off with a stronger solution for a short period of time , and rinse with lots of water straight after removing them also get any discoloration polished off before it has time to dry out as it will set back (oxidize) into the alloy
depending on how strong your solution was , they should have gone black or brown and the soluotion should have been bubbling getting warm and producing some nasty fumes , the last rim i stripped with caustic took a few mins to completely remove the anno from the whole rim
looking at the last pic the one with the pitted brake surface it looks to me as though the anno has not come of , there's a definate line betwween the side and top surface, where the brakes have rubbed, should be the same color side and top , noticed the stickers are still on too, usually they will come off when the anno dissolves underneath them , looking like these might be hard anno?
just out of interest again were the bricks you used to take up the volume nice and clean , caustic dissolves organic compounds very well so i suspect you've cleaned the bricks rather than the rims ? :D
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Thanks for the replys.
The bricks were pretty clean, and i could see and hear the solution fizzing away around the rims, giving off fumes etc. I did think it was strange that the decals had survived the dipping process! (the pitting also only seems to be on the braking surface?)
Anyway, this is a learning curve and what's done is done. Just wondering whether to carry on with these rims or source some others in good condition? These are never going to be perfect. Are they hard to come by, or does anyone know where i can get a pair of correct NOS UKAI 48 hole rims? Any suggestions appreciated :)
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Chaps, just considering my options. From what i've read, Peregrine 48s came with either Araya or Ukai rims. If i do decide to change the rims, does anyone know what i should go for? Mine are single walled Ukai's at the moment with loose bearing suzue hubs.
I have seen some NOS Araya 7x rims at a good price. If i lace these up to my suzue hubs and sticker them up as Peregrine 48s is this a no no? :2gunsfiring_v1: Did peregrine 48s ever come with 7 x rims?
I'm not very clued up with this stuff, so any lessons you guys want to give me will be greatly appreciated!
I'm just thinking it will be a shame to build up using my nice hubs/new spokes etc, only to be let down by the hoops....
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They only came with ukai rims.
I would rub the rims down with some wet and dry, going through the various grit levels until they look good.
Even though there is pitting it isn't that deep to effect the structure of the rim. You just need to put in a lot of elbow grease. :daumenhoch:
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Thanks for the info Discostu.
Does anyone know the type of rim i have? as far as i can tell they are early 48's with a single walled ukai rim, and from what i've researched it's a speedline. However all the speedlines i have seen have the raised nipple sections, whereas mine dont?
The Araya 7x's look very similar to the speedlines, is there much difference?
I'm still in two minds about what to do...Whether to build up a 48 spoke wheel with the peregrine hubs, 7 x rims and have a nice tidy set of 48's, or to be anal and get the correct rims. :idiot2: and in the meantime try and source some NOS ukais or keep working on mine.
I'm getting in way to deep with this project :LolLolLolLol:
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Evening guys/girls..
Well, i had the day off work today, so thought i'd attack the rear rim. It was pretty rough when it arrived, with a huge flat spot on it, and i thought it was unrepairable. Animal kindly lent me his wheel straightening kit, which worked a treat. It's not perfect, but I reckon it will true up ok.
Before:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/image_zps03bb7864.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/image_zps03bb7864.jpg.html)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/image_zps31088f6d.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/image_zps31088f6d.jpg.html)
And after a lot of elbow grease:
Flat spot was here:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2630_zpsb8410c32.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2630_zpsb8410c32.jpg.html)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2626_zpse08fc2a4.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2626_zpse08fc2a4.jpg.html)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2631_zpscbdb0ed3.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2631_zpscbdb0ed3.jpg.html)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_2627_zpsca4a384c.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_2627_zpsca4a384c.jpg.html)
Far from perfect, a few marks and tiny bit of pitting still visible, but im quite pleased with it. Havn't managed the mirror finish i was hoping for, as i hand polished them. Might give them another going over before i build them up.
Got the rear rim to fix/polish next. NOT looking forward to it :uglystupid2:
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:daumenhoch: Hard work but very rewarding fella ;)
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It has taken a while Animal, that's for sure! the tool worked a treat too :) i squished the spoke surface bit of the rim with the press, but its ever so small and slight - hardly noticeable. I also left the rim in the caustic soda for too long, causing some minor pitting, which i haven't been able to completely remove...its my first wheel resto, so i'll learn by my mistakes!
I'll be in touch when the other one is done, and get the kit off to the next person with square wheels ;)
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I would invest in a polishing kit from eBay. They fit into a drill with an arbour bit and three mops. This kit comes with 3 grades of polish in a soap form. Use a kit like this for a couple of hours and the results will be much better.
A kit like this is normally around £30. :daumenhoch:
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Stu, i bought 3 cotton mops and red and green compound to go in my drill. I wasn't sure what compound to use, so i attacked it by hand.
The polishing kit was only a cheapy tool station job-cost me £3 :LolLolLolLol:
Is it worth using? do you know what colour compound i should use? haven't a clue!
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What colours are they? :LolLolLolLol:
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green and red.
maybe one of these would be better....
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Metal-Polishing-Kit-3-Aluminium-Brass-NFK0-3001-/300529917133?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item45f8fa9ccd
I did consider buying a bench grinder and kit, but i've just gentlemans relished a load of cash on that master :bellend:
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I would say the red is coarse and the green is fine. :daumenhoch:
That kit on eBay looks ok as well. I tend to put the handle clamp around the drill and do that up in a vise, then hold what I'm polishing against the mop. It is much easier that way. 8)
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Thats a good idea! I'd better find a way of securing my new drill in my vice without wrecking it! I'll post results when i can be arsed to crack on with them again!
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Well i got one rim and hub completely finished today, and am half way through the second rim. Polished it some more, and applied the decals.
Feast your eyes on these: one with flash on/one with it off, to show off the bling :LolLolLolLol:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps1357f5ec.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps1357f5ec.jpg.html)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsd09f987f.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsd09f987f.jpg.html)
I still can't decide whether to go for black nipples or keep them silver. Come on chaps, give me your thoughts, i'm new and clueless :uglystupid2: :)
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They look great!
I think either colour could work (depending on what you're doing with the rest of the bike) but would probably choose silver myself
It's your bike though so go with whatever you think works best :daumenhoch:
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Amazing job! Im just about ready to polish a set myself too....and if they look half as good ill be happy!
I agree with Griff...silver nips all the way. But again....it depends on your build and how much you want the wheels to pop....after all, youve put many hard hours of work into them so far....id go with your gut :)
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Thanks for the comments guys, they are FAR from perfect, but you saw what i started with so, can't complain!
They will be going on this:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsfac91382.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsfac91382.jpg.html)
And here's what made me consider black spoke nipples:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps0aee6072.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps0aee6072.jpg.html)
I'm very much 50/50 :crazy2:
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Finally finished the front rim, decals applied, just need to get some spokes and lace them up :) Time is at a premium these days, so i might take them to my LBS and have them build them up. They are very knowledgeable and said it would't be a problem.
Here they are, waiting to be built (Can't stop looking at them "wantit"):
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsc267419d.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsc267419d.jpg.html)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps08006058.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps08006058.jpg.html)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps091f7c9b.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps091f7c9b.jpg.html)
Glad all that polishing is over with!!
I'm going for stainless spokes and silver nipples, and keeping them 'classic' I think it's the best option, and means i can fit them to anything 8)
A quick question...because i'm an anal twat and like attention to detail :LolLolLolLol:...
What way should the Peregrine lettering face when the rims are laced up?, obviously the front doesnt matter, but should the top of the letters be nearest the freewheel, or the other way round? (i hope you get what i mean :loser:)
Cheeeeers..
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:4_17_5: great job should look good when you build em , :daumenhoch:, i think the lettering goes same side as freewheel ie letters the right way up looking from the freewheel side , bottom of letters on freewheel side :daumenhoch: all the ones i've seen are like this , the front will only matter if you run directional tires ,
put em on, take em off, put em on, line up the logo's with the valves get the bobbles out, realize you put it back on the wrong way round take em off put em on................ :idiot2: :idiot2: its never ending :LolLolLolLol:
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Awesome job mate.... :smitten:
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Well, here they are chaps.. no photos of them off the bike, and they need a quick polish, but you get the idea. a couple of tiny 'jumps' but not noticeable when riding...Overall, pretty pleased with them :)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/o114/lowback/IMG_3106_zps3c36b313.jpg) (http://s118.photobucket.com/user/lowback/media/IMG_3106_zps3c36b313.jpg.html)
See my FST thread, for some more pictures:
http://www.radbmx.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,166722.25.html
:daumenhoch:
P.S.- Animal, i've Pm'd you (if you're reading this ;))
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Ace job :daumenhoch: