RADBMX.CO.UK
Technical & Reference Section => Tech and Restoration => Topic started by: snoopy72 on May 14, 2014, 09:22 PM
-
Today's progress, some pics.
-
Spot on, was disappointed when you pulled the 1st thread.
How did you do the crank spindle in the end?
well done!
MM
-
That is fooking mental!! Superb job :daumenhoch:
-
:)
-
How does it ride? :D
-
Haven't tried it yet, need to get the chain ring sorted first and adjust the brake disc
-
just fooking awesome :coolsmiley:
-
bet you'll be walking like John Wayne after riding it with your feet pointing at ten to two :teef:
can't wait to see it done :4_17_5:
-
awsum :4_17_5:
-
Bad ass bud :smitten: "wantit" :slayer:
-
Great thread and awesome skills
-
:daumenhoch: :daumenhoch: :daumenhoch: :daumenhoch: :daumenhoch:
-
i so want this when its done :smitten: its mental :4_17_5:
-
Got the front wheel finished last night, fitted the stainless DT swiss spokes and nipples, also removed the reflector bracket and schwinn stickers.
-
Proper mental!
-
wasn't this thread bit longer?... Anyway, that's way mad indeed :D
-
That is so cool. 8)
Cant imagine all the hard work that went in this. :coolsmiley:
-
That is so cool. 8)
Cant imagine all the hard work that went in this. :coolsmiley:
Started it May last year :popcorn:
might be a while before I get to finish the paint though
-
This is superb mate, please say it's going to be at MK? I'd love to see this bombing around the lake. :coolsmiley:
-
..or also on the lake for that matter :angel:
-
This has to be one of my favourite tech threads since I've been a member on here ... amazing stuff :4_17_5:
-
Looking good John :daumenhoch:
wasn't this thread bit longer?...
That's what i thought ,what happened to the old thread John :-\
PS Classy spokes ;) :daumenhoch:
-
That's right, I originally removed the thread to remake it and peeps were still asking about it so just added some pics to keep you updated, everyone loves a pic or two :LolLolLolLol:
I will do a parts list and specs from start to finish when it's completed :daumenhoch:
-
bet you'll be walking like John Wayne after riding it with your feet pointing at ten to two :teef:
can't wait to see it done :4_17_5:
Thats what I thought originally griff, but your feet sit straight, and I rode my supergoose a whole day with my feet on the out side of the pedals before the project started and the crank is no wider than a scwhinn stingray chopper.
-
My favourite thread on :radbmxsmilie:
Looking forward to the next episode of this truly epic build. Great skills John. :daumenhoch:
-
Will we be seeing this beast at MK?
I want to see you wheelying around Willen Lake :slayer:
-
looks awesome!!! get steve firebird to make you some fat oversized padset...
-
Love these unique builds and things like making your own stems etc.
Would love to see this too at MK.
Looks great cant wait to see it finished :daumenhoch:
-
http://www.mongoosemassif.com/specs/ ;)
-
Thanks for the link, Interesting read, I have seen these, good value too
I was going to fit a sturmey archer 8 speed hub at one point but want to save the weight and you can't beat the sound of a white industries freewheel.
The mongoose massive is like a small mountainbike and not sure if you could use it for anything.
-
Will we be seeing this beast at MK?
I want to see you wheelying around Willen Lake :slayer:
Not sure I can make it to MK , as for Willen lake , my back's still playing up, having a job putting me socks on in the morning let alone wheelying.
When finished I do plan on getting some proper pics with a friends camera
-
Hit a bit of a problem :LolLolLolLol:
-
I'd stick a couple of triangular gussets with holes through them on either side of the bb to mimic the goose gusset
-
That's what i'm thinking Jay, would like to mimick the 76 gusset, asking a couple of peeps dimensions of this gusset, not many 75/76 gooses around :popcorn:
Would like to just gusset along both sides of the rear triangle but might have to do between down tube and bb as well, where do I stop though ? could also do between seat post tube and bb both sides , what flex is acceptable ? before you could have frame failure
-
Crude I know, but something like this
-
could you fit and internal sleve in the bottom bracket ,leaving it short effort to just fit the bearing cups as normal might streathen things up with out losing the looks.
-
It's also knowing where it will make a difference without bracing it everywhere, I could brace it like Jay suggested but maybe I would get the same effect along side the rectangle to the bb ?
-
could you fit and internal sleve in the bottom bracket ,leaving it short effort to just fit the bearing cups as normal might streathen things up with out losing the looks.
Can't do that because I still need to have the arms the same difference apart and it's the extra leverage that's causing the problem.
To be fair, might be better off leaving it , my standard mongoose frame flexes nearly as bad, i think all steel bicycle frames have a bit of flex there from what I have read.
-
Just had a thought, if I do a gusset like Jay suggested matching the 75/76 goose on the drive side , which will eliminate up and down movement and on the left hand side another matching gusset but along side the rectangle to brace left and right movement.
It will help with stiffening it up but save all the weight of making match pairs of brackets
Two offset gussets with matching drill holes of a 76
-
To be honest, you will find those alloy cranks flex a lot too.
-
To be honest, you will find those alloy cranks flex a lot too.
Yes Terry, they are also flexing
-
I have contacted a couple of well known frame builders to get an opinion, see what they say, If I brace the area in question it could also transport the problem to the top tube where it joins the seat post mast, I had a mitygoose that snapped here years ago.
-
:4_17_5: love this project ,
could you not just fatten up the chain stay box? making it wider, could be added to rather than removing the existing one, don't think it would spoil the looks as the rear end is so wide already , weld on the top join could be ground in so it looks like one box section , would have thought i would be stiff enough to stop the displacement transfer to the top/seat tube weld?
looks to be about 80% of the bb width is covered by the chain stay box on a goose so perhaps it needs to be similar proportion on this , the gussets are a good idea but i think would detract from the distinctive goose chain stay bridge ? :-\
this may cause issues with the bottom tube , twisting under load at the bb? :-\
-
Thanks for all your thoughts and ideas, yes the flex feels to be at the rectangle tube , maybe if I enlarge the rectangle not to the full 80% as not to put the stresses towards the seat mast and down tubes.
What about enlarging the stay bridge and then fitting a 76 gusset between the down tube and seat mast to affectively join them together?
It would be interesting to know why mongoose fitted this gusset to the 75 and 76 and then removed it ?
-
:4_17_5: love this project ,
I'm not feeling the love at the moment :LolLolLolLol:
-
I think without having scaled up tube diameters to suit, your build was always going to be prone to a bit of flex. The width of the bb presents a considerable increase in leverage perpendicular to the seat tube. If you can live with it I would put up with the flex unless you have serious concerns about an actual failure of the frame. For me any gussets added around the bb short of a wider square section between the bb and the hoop would spoil the look of the build.
-
I spoke to a frame builder and he said if you brace it, it's a bit like sticking a band aid over it, it will only cause a problem at the end of each brace making that part the weakest, he also said the same as oldschoolace that ideally all the frame tubes needed to be enlarged, the only problem with this is you would then have a weak spot at the headstock because you would still have to use a normal size headset and stem.
I think you could go on forever and it certainly wouldn't resemble a mongoose when finished, I'm waiting for more suggestions apart from throwing it in the plastic thing with a lift up lid :LolLolLolLol:
Maybe just extending the rear rectangle a bit would help, this is where it feels weakest and then hope for the best, I certainly know it's not going to be suitable for a table top, I do like hutch bars but don't fancy a face full of them.
-
This might be a total nonsense but would be easy to test. what about filling the tubes with, expanding foam? wouldn't add any weight but the honeycomb structure may help stiffen things up. You could cut yourself two identical pieces of copper pipe, fill one with foam and test it against the other with some weights hung over the middle.
As I say, could be bullshit but could also be a cheap and easy fix :daumenhoch:
-
:LolLolLolLol: I'm open to any suggestions at the moment, i'd fill the tubes full of tampons if it worked :LolLolLolLol:
unfornunately the only tubes accessible are the rear stays and seat mast, the rest are sealed.
The flex doesn't seem to be getting as far as the rear stays only the bb area.
I suppose It will never be as flexible as riding a hinged Raleigh Hercules shopper bike with the hinge unclamped
-
I think it'll crack where the bb meets the box the way it is under heavy load, in my opinion that's the area pedaling will stress most as power is transferred to the rear wheel via the cranks.
I'd consider increasing the size of the box.
As it would reduce the bb flexing I think this might actually reduce the stress on where the down tube and seat tube meet the bb.
Might increase the stress where the down tube meets the head tube though.
Any structural engineers on here?
-
I think your right, it feels the weakest under a bit of load but I haven't really forced it because I don't want to twist it out of shape, at the moment it springs back.
I was originally worried about the crankshaft, no chance of that breaking
-
If the expanding foam idea proved usefull you could drill little "weep" holes to inject it in. :)
-
I think it'll crack where the bb meets the box the way it is under heavy load, in my opinion that's the area pedaling will stress most as power is transferred to the rear wheel via the cranks.
I'd consider increasing the size of the box.
As it would reduce the bb flexing I think this might actually reduce the stress on where the down tube and seat tube meet the bb.
Might increase the stress where the down tube meets the head tube though.
Any structural engineers on here?
The headstock on a mongoose is pretty strong with the gusset, not known a mongoose to break there.
I've known one snap at the top of the seat mast tube but that could have been caused by the seat post not in far enough. all in all mongoose did make a strong frame but can it handle my modifications ? It will certainly be a test for it
Skip Hess would probably say "nono" your going to hurt yourself you :bellend:
-
I'd consider increasing the size of the box.
You boasting again ;D Most of us would prefer to see a smaller box but, in this case of requiring a bigger box for the extra stiffness gained, I would have to agree :D
-
I'd consider increasing the size of the box.
You boasting again ;D Most of us would prefer to see a smaller box but, in this case of requiring a bigger box for the extra stiffness gained, I would have to agree :D
I agree the box needs to be wider, got to be careful not to go too wide as this will in turn move the stress to the bottom stay tubes, then brace the top and bottom stays together, this moves the stress to the top stay where it meets the triangle, brace this and the top of the seat mast and the stress now moves to the bottom of the seat mast, brace this then it moves to the base of the down tube, brace this then it moves to the headstock, brace this more and now it makes the forks weak , brace these and now I have a bike that looks and feels as heavy as an Austin Allegro.
-
I'd consider increasing the size of the box.
You boasting again ;D Most of us would prefer to see a smaller box but, in this case of requiring a bigger box for the extra stiffness gained, I would have to agree :D
;)
:LolLolLolLol:
-
i think increasing the size of the chain stay box is the way to go , i would assume that goose used this method to get round the flex problem on the original goose frame , as the front end is held solid with the gusset , :-\
-
A lot of bmx's were prone in the 70's to snapping at the headstock after big jumps and mongoose used the gusset design on theirs.
-
Spent all morning making cardboard templates and then cut these out of a piece of 50 x 20 rectangle box section, they fit great.
I'm going to do 2 types of strengthening and take a chance ! the next stage is paint, the only time it will be built again will be when it's finished.
I'm going to extend the cigarette box and fit a 1976 frame gusset, I think this gusset will look ok because like the 76 model my frame doesn't have a rear brake bridge.
Just waiting for the 2mm plate to arrive and then pop to the engineer and ask if he can drill a nice clean 16mm hole in it, then I can cut out the shape from a cardboard template that i've made from the original specs which Johnny goose kindly took time to take his 76 out of storage, unbox it and measure the gusset for me.
I didn't want to go too wide with the box , I don't want to transfer the problem to another place and make it look wrong to the triangle gusset above it at the top of the seatmast.
-
That looks bombproof, good work. :4_17_5:
-
:LolLolLolLol:
-
Great stuff :daumenhoch:
-
Proper job :daumenhoch:
-
:daumenhoch:
with the down tube gusset i would have thought it will be solid enough , at the very least no more bendy than an og frame , comparing the update shots to the first box tube shots i think it needed to be bigger any how even without the need to overcome the flex , looking forward to the next update
:daumenhoch:
-
You'd be surprised how much more leverage 60mm has made over the standard bb, if I go too big with the box it will make it weak on the bottom stay tubing just as it leaves the box.
It was 40mm and now it's 80mm, to get the same distance between the end of the cups and the rectangle to make it visually the same as the original it would have to be 100mm which will look like a video cassette.
-
:daumenhoch:
with the down tube gusset i would have thought it will be solid enough , at the very least no more bendy than an og frame , comparing the update shots to the first box tube shots i think it needed to be bigger any how even without the need to overcome the flex , looking forward to the next update
:daumenhoch:
My thinking is, if the leverage could make one of the tubes crack at the weld then joining them together it would have to crack 2 tubes which is unlikely.
I don't want to risk doing just the rectangle , painting it then wishing I had fitted the gusset , the gusset is just a precaution.
Maybe it doesn't need it.
-
Great work, this is progressing nicely :daumenhoch:
-
I do too much thinking :LolLolLolLol:
I thought lets make the triangle match the rectangle.
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4623_zpsfcf43a7e.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4623_zpsfcf43a7e.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4622_zps9a1fd15c.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4622_zps9a1fd15c.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4619_zps19cda0a1.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4619_zps19cda0a1.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4618_zpse69a2a2e.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4618_zpse69a2a2e.jpg.html)
-
There's nowt wrong with thought, just keep it to a minimum and keep this thing going.
I look forward to the updated instalments mate. :coolsmiley:
-
Think SE have got wind of this project and wanted to have a go themselves
-
:2funny: :LolLolLolLol:
-
:2funny: :LolLolLolLol:
Wish I could TIG , i'd have it done by now :daumenhoch:
Now then, for the colour, (yellow or white) ?? or the original blue metallic and what about the anodised parts, what colour ? any thoughts ?
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/T2eC16NzUE9s389zFjBR4vH8S4YQ60_57_zps99a9b672.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/T2eC16NzUE9s389zFjBR4vH8S4YQ60_57_zps99a9b672.jpg.html)
-
I like a yellow and black motomag
-
I like a yellow and black motomag
I've been looking at the seat leon yellow but got to find the paint code for it, maybe I could stop someone at the lights with one and ask them to pop the hood or door shut so I can get it :LolLolLolLol:
Anyway I think it's Ovni yellow S1H but the cupra I saw looked like a straight colour, if you put the colour in on the net it says it's metallic.
-
I like a yellow and black motomag
I've been looking at the seat leon yellow but got to find the paint code for it, maybe I could stop someone at the lights with one and ask them to pop the hood or door shut so I can get it :LolLolLolLol:
Anyone on here got a yellow 2004 FR TDI Leon ?
Onvi Yellow - S1H. :daumenhoch:
-
I like a yellow and black motomag
I've been looking at the seat leon yellow but got to find the paint code for it, maybe I could stop someone at the lights with one and ask them to pop the hood or door shut so I can get it :LolLolLolLol:
Anyone on here got a yellow 2004 FR TDI Leon ?
Onvi Yellow - S1H. :daumenhoch:
Thanks fella, I phoned the paint shop and they said they can mix it in solvent no problem
-
I thought Griff was on about this when he mentioned SE...
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/06/09/uheryny4.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Like the giant pro class rims above.
Dropped some parts off to the anodiser's this morning, parts to be done,
seat clamp
disc adapter
front and rear dropout savers
cranks
-
I have cut out the gusset and got the anodising back today, the black parts are hard black and the dura ace cranks are now a one off colour of gun metal blue :daumenhoch: The final welding for the frame is booked for next week and I'll post some more pics when this is completed
-
awesome, excited to see this
-
Do love this bike :)
-
more pics :daumenhoch: should do the trick
-
:daumenhoch: should be solid enough now , looks a lot better aswell :daumenhoch:
-
I would b tempted 2 anneal all that welding . Lot of stress been put in the tubes now .
-
:welcome
I would b tempted 2 anneal all that welding . Lot of stress been put in the tubes now .
Shoundn't do Animal, TIG is a more controlled than MIG and I didn't cool it, all cooled down oh naturale,
If I had dunked it in water afterwards it would cause the metal to go brittle that's for sure.
Thanks for the heads up, i'll will look into it :daumenhoch:
What I did notice is when I held all the parts in the correct position while he tacked them they didn't even get luke warm , if it was MIG it would have cooked my pinkies.
-
Looks great, and almost original
-
Today's progress, some pics.
final welding complete.
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4479_zps69ab6651.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4479_zps69ab6651.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4478_zps39e115f6.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4478_zps39e115f6.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4475_zpsdfdaa9e7.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4475_zpsdfdaa9e7.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4491_zpsa2b82689.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4491_zpsa2b82689.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4492_zpsbb2c6674.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4492_zpsbb2c6674.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_4489_zps8974b34b.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_4489_zps8974b34b.jpg.html)
lookin sweet john.
Thanks for posting at retrogoose.
I've added some more bikes an projects here at radbmx under "me & my bikes".
-
:bow:
That lower bb gusset looks perfect size too! :coolsmiley:
-
Is this gonna b at MK . Dying 2 c it finished its awesome :4_17_5:
-
What a box and such a noice gussett!!!
Good work, this is looking great; what's it like to ride?
-
:bow:
That lower bb gusset looks perfect size too! :coolsmiley:
Thanks Johnng :daumenhoch: couldn't have got it right without your help
-
What a box and such a noice gussett!!!
Good work, this is looking great; what's it like to ride?
Believe it or not but I haven't even tried to ride it yet but I know it will be fine.
Mrs snoopy "bump" and has got me doing some major alterations to the garden, if I try and finish the bike now the :10_2_12: so it's on the back burner, the most important bits, engineering, anodising, tube bending and welding is now complete so at least if I can paint it sometime before the end of summer i'll be happy
To be fair the Mrs :smitten: has been very patient throughout the whole project :daumenhoch:
-
:bow:
That lower bb gusset looks perfect size too! :coolsmiley:
Thanks Johnng :daumenhoch: couldn't have got it right without your help
yup your :welcome john
-
couple of more items , :coolsmiley: I have been informed by a reliable source that these are the wrong year grips, I may look into this a bit further to get the right year, need to be anti blister, clear and era correct though. BITD I only ever used odi mushrooms and I won't be fitting mongoose (BLISTER) grips.
-
That's more like it :coolsmiley:
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/p1017095_blowup_zpsf5d7aac6.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/p1017095_blowup_zpsf5d7aac6.jpg.html)
-
Has this been painted yet John? ???
-
No not yet :tumbleweed:
-
Lovin this ride , not old school but Somin different :daumenhoch:
-
I'm going to try and keep it as old school as possible :daumenhoch:
-
Keep coming back to this. Its so clever. "wantit"
-
A touch of blue 81 style
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/TUFSTEM3_zps4c142337.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/TUFSTEM3_zps4c142337.jpg.html)
-
A touch of blue 81 style
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/TUFSTEM3_zps4c142337.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/TUFSTEM3_zps4c142337.jpg.html)
Nice.
-
I say 81 style because I bought it as a fake, I paid quite strong money for it , in between fake and OG infact :idiot2: but still very nice all the same :coolsmiley:
-
I now have a mongoose double clamp stem, if I use this stem I also have a set of unknurled hutch expert bars to go with it.
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_3250_zps03d7b836.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_3250_zps03d7b836.jpg.html)
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/IMG_3252_zps283f9bd3.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/IMG_3252_zps283f9bd3.jpg.html)(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b588/hooliganbbb72/image_copy5075_lg_zpscd63ffad.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/hooliganbbb72/media/image_copy5075_lg_zpscd63ffad.jpg.html)
-
go double clamp.. keep it goose ... :)
-
:coolsmiley:
-
:
I'm going to try and keep it as old school as possible :daumenhoch:
:daumenhoch: