RADBMX.CO.UK
New School BMX 2004 - Now => New School Racing => Topic started by: b45t4rd on March 21, 2009, 07:58 AM
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:shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
http://bmxtalk.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=21432&sid=d9b5a3e50e4c406f85278dc7676994ec
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:crazy2:
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I must admit that the pictures do not make it look very pretty.
However........ having seen it in the flesh its not actually that bad.
Matt
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I have a contender :D
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/jj239/bmxbob/Photo-0213.jpg)
Got it from the scrappy, as i said i would buy all of the BMXs that come in.
Wonder how many of these i will have to buy untill a TA turns up ::)
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tis not pretty but surely the latest gt ultrabox is worse
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I have a contender :D
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/jj239/bmxbob/Photo-0213.jpg)
Got it from the scrappy, as i said i would buy all of the BMXs that come in.
Wonder how many of these i will have to buy untill a TA turns up ::)
That looks a hell of a lot like the new VDC changa, which strangely enough is one of the ugliest frame's ever.
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'tis an absolute minger, but I was talking to an Elite rider who's rode it and he reckons it was spot on. The bent seat post virtually eliminates flex in the bottom bracket and according to Mr.Elite, "It just wants to go forward". i've seen the smaller versions in the flesh and in action at the Belgium Euro and it's a quality product. You could level the same sort of criticism at a ONE frame, which I personally think are pig-ugly, but they've had one or two results in the right hands...
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As a titanium fan and as someone who has designed titanium BMX frames which have won Euro and National titles and made worlds finals, I was excited to hear that another company (Pure) was bringing out a titanium BMX race frame. However, I must admit I was massively underwhelmed/disappointed when I saw that pic of Laurence Mapp's bike. A beautiful material like Ti deserves a more beautiful end product.
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after seeing the pic yesterday i thought this was a really bad looking frame. But saw 1 at the race at derby today and it didnt look as bad. still wouldnt want one though ???
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:) That Pure is a pure vulgarity.....On looks alone,I wouldn`t buy one.Does the weird seattube really do anything for performance- a question for one of our enginering experts?
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I don't believe the claim that the seat tube being bent stiffens the BB area (especially as the seat tube seems to be welded to the downtube, not the BB). If they wanted to achieve a stiffer BB, they should have done what they've done at the head tube and have the BB shell piercing the down tube.
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Apparantly a lot of design and development went into the Pure frame at (I think) Loughborough Uni, and the stiffness was measured against traditional frame layouts by computer modelling. Probably by 'boffins' in white coats, but I think the claim for extra stiffness comes with some serious research behind it rather than just guesswork. I had a good look at the frames again at Derby yesterday, and to be fair they do look a lot less 'clumsy' in the flesh. It is nice to see a British manufacturer trying something different though, and nobody can accuse them of going for a safe-bet and an easy buck with such a 'Marmite' shape as this.
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British manufacturer :shocked: I didnt realise that , cue Teamsano to give it a good slating. :D
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that looks amazing!
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that looks amazing!
:2funny: :2funny: :2funny: :2funny: :2funny: :2funny:
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Diggler is always on the lookout for something with Extra stiffness and but they also must be flexable ::)
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This frame looks like a creation made by someone who makes dogs and alike shapes with them long balloons :LolLolLolLol:
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Had a little go on one, it's nice but it's not a technique ;) :Great_Britain:
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I had a go on one of these at Royston yesterday and it was very very stiff, probably the stiffest BMX that i'd ever ridden, but not that light, the frame only weighs a tiny bit less than my steel Standard 125r. It wasn't as bad looking in the flesh as it looks in the pictures, but not my cup of tea, but neither are carbon forks. Each to their own though.
Thanks to Ria for letting me have a go.
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I had a go on one of these at Royston yesterday and it was very very stiff, probably the stiffest BMX that i'd ever ridden, but not that light, the frame only weighs a tiny bit less than my steel Standard 125r.
I'm surprised they've made it like that.
One of the main reasons for using Ti is to make a frame that's as light as aluminium but as strong as cro-moly.
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it looks like a cheap 90's frame. The slingshot's still king when it comes to ugly.
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looks like its been chasin parked cars.
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it looks like a cheap 90's frame. The slingshot's still king when it comes to ugly.
Oi, watch you language Mr Acid, that is fighting talk. :knuppel2: ;)
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I had a go on one of these at Royston yesterday and it was very very stiff, probably the stiffest BMX that i'd ever ridden, but not that light, the frame only weighs a tiny bit less than my steel Standard 125r.
I'm surprised they've made it like that.
One of the main reasons for using Ti is to make a frame that's as light as aluminium but as strong as cro-moly.
Mike, I don’t know what the exact design criteria was for the frame, but I think making it as stiff as possible was more important than making it the lightest frame possible. I did chat with Rich T briefly about the design and he was putting more emphasis on the way the tubes we angled and where they were joined than anything else. The way the top tube came through the head tube reminded me of a VDC or a 2HIP, so it’s just a progression of that idea I think. Where the seat tube met the down tube just in front of the BB reminded me of what Giant did with their 4X bikes in 2002/3ish (when Oggy rode for them). I don’t claim to know anything about frame design and stuff like that, but as I said in my previous post it was the stiffest thing I’ve ever sprinted. Ria’s bike had carbons on it and the front end felt stupidly light when you rode it, it wouldn’t suit me at all, I’d ski jump everything and loop out manuals all over the place if I had one.
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Miles, not questioning your analysis in any way. Just curious why someone who wanted to design a stiff frame would use titanium (which is flexier than alloy and steel when used in similar quantities).
I've been thinking of making a stiff and light frame recently but it will be made of alloy, not Ti or steel.
I still think titanium is a brilliant material to make bike frames from, but when you start making Ti frames stiffer than alloy or stronger than cro-mo, the return in investment is a diminishing one, and you have to question why titanium is being used if the weight saving benefits are lost.
My new MX20R cro-moly frames are stiffer than the Technique titanium frames, about 2x stronger and cost 66% less, but they do weigh about 10 ozs more.
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Mike I totally agree with what your saying.
I've worked in and out of the industry and have had a lot of dealings with roadies, mtbers and bmxers.
It seems a quality designed and well applied steel frame is still the PEOPLES choice. That means all of the above sectors.
Titanium needs to be made thicker therefore heavier. Carbon is exactly the same, the avent frames from a few years ago were not that light, as the carbon needed more layers to be used in a BMX application.
If somebody wanted to make an out and out stiff and light race frame, sadly the material should be alloy. This would make it affordable and easy to put into production(see taiwan).
The price of the these new frames will be very similar I suspect Mike to what the Technique ones were. Don't mean to offend, but its just not a price that will meet most BMXers budgets, not matter how serious they are.
So, buy alloy if you want light weight and stiffness. You will have to change your frame every 12-18 months mind.
Buy Ti if you have a deep pocket, it resembles steel in the feel and is plenty strong if built right (see Dialled).
Or, do as I do and get quality steel and ride it to death.
Pardon me if I'm speaking bollox!
sutty
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So, buy alloy if you want light weight and stiffness. You will have to change your frame every 12-18 months mind.
I'd like to design an alloy frame as I haven't done that before, but the thing that puts me off most is I know I'd be designing something with a shelf life, unlike the steel or Ti frames I've designed which could last forever.
If I made an alloy frame I'd call it Jamaican Bacon!
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Mike,
there lies the bonus,
surely a min shelf life means more sales if the design is a winner, you'd be guaranteed revenue!!
The only thing that wouldn't sell in the uk mind, is a uk designed alloy race frame. Just because the majority of the UK are trend whores. Where tight jeans, micro gear and steel frames are the winner.
Unless the marketing was on the money.
Look at the revell's that came out 2 years ago. No-one other than team riders have run one. I for one have never seen a bought one being ridden. They are not a bad design (well the cruiser ain't great), but no marketing means no market.
Whatever you did Mike, I'm sure you'd make it work. Look at where you are now.
Sutty
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surely a min shelf life means more sales if the design is a winner, you'd be guaranteed revenue!!
True. Alloy frames are the best money spinner for the industry as they need replacing. I just don't like the idea of designing summat that I know will break eventually. Only had 7 dialled bikes frames out of almost 1000 break since I started the company in 2003. I bet some companies get that many warranty returns a week. I know if I start making alloy frames that number will soon go up.
I think I'd be able to sell decent numbers of alloy race frames as the brand is strong on the race scene at the moment. But I know what you mean about fads. When I came back to racing again in 2006, loads of people were riding One Bicycles frames and they seemed really popular. Hardly see anybody on them now. Intense Podium seems to be the No.1 alloy race frame at the moment.
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banana tubes all the way Mike.
It'll be next years black I tell ya!