RADBMX.CO.UK
Technical & Reference Section => Tech and Restoration => Topic started by: Mikku on January 02, 2017, 12:59 AM
-
Being based in Japan, I’m always on the look-out for interesting Japanese-made frames, which usually means something from the Tange or Koizumi factories, so when I spotted this for sale over on the Museum, I snapped it up! I knew nothing about Ross Bicycles but upon further investigation it seems that in amongst the lower quality bikes they were known for, there was a decent bike in the form of the oddly-named MX-Time. Not to be confused with the lower-spec Piranha or Pantera, this was a short-lived but high-end model with quality, Japanese components. There is a good test on the bike in the July ’83 edition of BMX Plus, and a picture of one adorns the front cover:-
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/July%2083%20test%201.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/July%2083%20test%201.jpg.html)
There’s also a great advert for the complete bike in the Feb '83 edition of BMX Action:-
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/MX-Time%20ad.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/MX-Time%20ad.jpg.html)
This frameset was sourced from the States but originally assembled in the Tange factory [edit:- see comments below for further discussion on this!] in September 1982. I say assembled because the interesting thing about this frame is that it uses Ishiwata tubing, which was also used for the first batch of Skyway T/As. :daumenhoch:
It has some oval tubes and similar dropouts to my Laserlite. However, what sets it apart is the Redline-esque small gusset behind the bottom of the headtube. The condition of the frame is lovely and the welds are, as you’d expect from Tange, excellent. Likewise the bologna cut forks. Here are a few pics of the frameset:-
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%201.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%201.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%202.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%202.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%204.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%204.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%205.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%205.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%207.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%207.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%208.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Frame%208.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Forks%201.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Forks%201.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Forks%203.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Forks%203.jpg.html)
This bike was found complete and matched the spec of the bike in the BMX Plus test. Subsequently parted-out, I grabbed the frameset and Takagi Tourney AD 3-piece crankset, and had them shipped back to their homeland. I also had the chance to buy the original Arayas but passed them up due to reliability concerns over the Maillard Helicomatic hubs, which was one of the main criticisms of the bike in the July ’83 test.
So with most of the og parts gone and no desire to go for a factory build, I’ve chosen a mixture of largely Japanese-made parts, in keeping with the spirit of the original spec, though with a few concessions to get the bike up and running. Here's a teaser pic:-
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Ross%20build.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Ross%20build.jpg.html)
At the moment I'm undecided whether to go with the silver Arayas that I've been using on my recent builds ('84 Free Agent and '84 Motobecane) or "borrow" the black Z-rims from my Laserlite. In any case I'm hoping, or rather, I need to get this done this month, so watch this space! :daumenhoch:
-
Same main tubes and gusset as Procraft which also used Ishiwata tubing, very similar forks too although the Procraft has a 5 inch head tube but you can see the similarities in the front triangle.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g114/martycoughlin/ProCraft/IMG_2605.jpg)
-
Yeah, I was eyeing up one those recently as well! They have smoother-looking dropouts than the "normal" Tange offering! Very nice! :daumenhoch:
-
A great find and an interesting read. I've never heard of these before. Top work so far :daumenhoch:
-
Nice looking frame and forks Mick :daumenhoch:
What bars are you gonna use?
-
Thanks guys! :)
What bars are you gonna use?
I picked up some Win Pro bars on here a while back, and had been keeping them back for this, but they got an advance viewing on the Motobecane! :daumenhoch:
-
Looks as if it's had an easy life from the finish on the frame set
-
I love stuff like this .. Proper rare exotica .. Lovin' the 80s babes in the advert too!
-
Tidy looking bike in the making there. :daumenhoch:
-
Looks a good quality frame :4_17_5:
-
Looking forward to this one.
I am also interested in the 'Procraft' frame pictured in this thread. I like frames with track racing dropouts, I have one myself. Although frequently associated with low end BMX (unjust as far as my research has shown) they are kinda' neat.
-
Nice one Mick - every day is a school day on here :daumenhoch:
-
Very nice find Mick! The weldings looking really good! :4_17_5: I'll keep an eye on this thread :daumenhoch:
-
Lovely looking frame that Mick. When I first saw the Ross Piranha ad I wondered if it was a Tange frame but later found out about the Ishiwata connection. Are you sure about Tange fabrication on this? I would have thought US fabrication was more likely :/
Is there anything stamped on the forks?
-
Thanks for the comments guys! For what it's worth, I prefer the babe in black on the left! :daumenhoch:
Lovely looking frame that Mick. When I first saw the Ross Piranha ad I wondered if it was a Tange frame but later found out about the Ishiwata connection. Are you sure about Tange fabrication on this? I would have thought US fabrication was more likely :/
Is there anything stamped on the forks?
Cheers Paul! I'll bow to your greater wisdom on all things Tange, as I have no real idea on the fabrication - that was just supposition on my part, going on the Tange BB and Ishiwata tubing. 2 + 2 = 5 and all that! :daumenhoch:
Actually, when I first picked up the frameset I contacted Tom Kellogg, the framebuilder who worked for Ross in the early 80s (he designed their high-end road bikes) to see if he could shed any light on it but he said that he'd had no involvement with the BMX bikes. :'(
I will check the forks. What are you expecting to see, if anything?
-
Does it have the classic Tange type T stamp serial on the BB Mick? I know you put a lot of time in researching your builds and it could well have been fabricated in Japan, I'm just not sure Tange would take an order without using their own tubes. I've read that Ishiwata tubes were extremely highly regarded and produced a similar range of products to Tange. There's also a slight difference in the shape of the drop-outs to the ones Tange used.
If the BB has the classic T stamp it could well be that it was fabricated by Toyo (as in the custom race bike you spotted a while back) ;)
-
BB pic as requested, with one of '83 Laserlite by way of comparison! :daumenhoch:
Same fabricator perhaps?? I was thinking about contacting Toyo anyway (about the afore-mentioned, new school race rig!), so maybe I should send them these BB pics and see what they say! I love this historical/detective stuff!! :D
-
Looks like I got a bit mixed up with Toyo. Tokyo Kogyo was the fabricator ;)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170110/f6343baa5f0e1c0b6b64e3242d2184a6.png)
-
Actually Paul, you may still be right, as here's something that Ian wrote over on the Museum:-
Tange did not do the welding on Kuwaharas, they supplied tubes and Tokyo Kogyo (they are now called Toyo) did the welding...
In any case, it looks like both my Ross and Laserlite frames were fabricated/made/welded by Tokyo Kogyo, the former with Ishiwata tubing and the later with Tange! Glad we got that sorted! :daumenhoch:
-
Sweet, it's in good company then ;)
-
I wondered why my newly aquired Laserlite had a T3 serial but not the Tange Japan stamp.
Now I know.
-
A snowboarding trip and trying to sort out a new school race bike meant that the Ross got sidelined for a bit, but I've finally managed to get it done and out for a shakedown ride the other day. :daumenhoch:
I might lower the seat a little or even swap out the straight post for a layback but what are your initial thoughts?
-
Looks spot on Mick
-
Like it, like it, like it 8) :daumenhoch:
Maybe push the seat back on the rails a tad but it's a super sweet build dude.
-
Turned out well needs a Ross seat.
-
really like it :4_17_5:
-
Super sleek race bike looks :slayer:
Maybe a layback seat post would make it look too much like a Laserlite?
-
Thanks for your comments guys!
Yeah, the seat could definitely go back a bit, and that might reduce the desire for a layback. Good point about the Laserlite, especially as I'd be robbing/using the layback off mine!! ;)
Turned out well needs a Ross seat.
Funny you should say that because I nearly bought this:-
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/seat%202.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/seat%202.jpg.html)
Thought it was quite cool but decided to save some pennies and use the Araike Jaguar instead. :daumenhoch:
Will move the seat back and get some decent pics taken this weekend, weather permitting.
-
Looking good :4_17_5:
-
I like that seat a Velo Lightning bolt I think?
-
Yeah, that's the one! :daumenhoch:
So I moved the seat a smidgen back on the rails, and the seat post down a bit, then went out and took some more pics this morning. Here's a few of 'em:-
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Ross%20forum%201.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Ross%20forum%201.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Ross%20set%201d.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Ross%20set%201d.jpg.html)
(http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m572/Trident393/Ross%20MX-Time/Ross%203rd%20pics%20034.jpg) (http://s1132.photobucket.com/user/Trident393/media/Ross%20MX-Time/Ross%203rd%20pics%20034.jpg.html)
I'll post some more pics with a full parts list in the old school race section! :daumenhoch:
-
Liking that lots :daumenhoch:
-
me likey likey :daumenhoch:
-
That looks very nice indeed! :4_17_5: Well done Mick! :daumenhoch:
-
Thank you gentlemen! I've just posted a few more pics here:-
http://www.radbmx.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,189774.0.html