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RADBMX.CO.UK  |  Technical & Reference Section  |  Tech and Restoration  |  New build, something a bit different.
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Author Topic: New build, something a bit different.  (Read 3159 times)

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Offline Avro

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New build, something a bit different.
« on: January 14, 2017, 01:41 PM »
This is going to be a slow build but posting a thread helps with motivation, and I rather like posting, so here goes! It is also one of three projects I have on the go, not quite sure how that happened it sort of just did.
 
I have had this lugged frame for some time, bought without much thought and on a whim really:

* P1010610.JPG (172.63 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 53 times.)


My enthusiasm to build it has gone up and down like a yo-yo but I have now found a theme with which to play with. I am going to build a quirky rider with quirky parts; things I would never consider fitting but saying 'to hell with it, it's going on!'

After a lot of research I tracked it down. It is a 'Racergoose', a 'brand' that I believe was specific to asian markets. It shares many characteristics of similar brands like Apollo, KLM and and Scorpion. These bike are often dismissed out-of-hand as being low end, nasty and cheaply made; this is far from the case. Some were base models for sure but poorly made: no. Some of the bikes were quite high spec. In the thread linked below is a nos 'Racergoose' complete with Araya (steel) rims, Takagi three piece crank and Kashimax saddle and another similarly speced but with OGK wheels:
http://www.ozbmx.com.au/topic/7983-another-score-from-malaysia/#comment-1140465

I love the way the Aussie scene has a foot in both worlds, the West and the East.

The sticker on the frame top tube, near the seat mast does state that the bike is High Tensile steel but there were other varients of the Racergoose that were chro-mo. The lugged ones are high tensile, the chro-mo ones welded.

I wanted to see how good the lug work was so another victory for Synstrip ensued and:

* P1010677.JPG (303.39 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 45 times.)


* P1010678.JPG (334.18 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 61 times.)


* P1010679.JPG (300.61 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 65 times.)


* P1010683.JPG (368.48 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 47 times.)

Not bad at all. Plenty of brass, soldering fully filling all the joints. Also the tubes are fully inserted into the lugs. This is well made. I keep mentioning this because it grates on me when reading threads that scoff at bikes like this. There is nothing cheap about making a lugged frame. All it is horses for courses, bikes for different markets. One thing that does irk me a little is the rip-off decals which ape Mongoose in style, colours and, of course, name. Not sure how am going to deal with that later on, I will have to ponder on it.

« Last Edit: October 17, 2017, 03:18 PM by Avro »
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2017, 01:51 PM »
...the ARX fork has been snaffled by another build. This bike is getting pinched TX1200's. I traded for a set on Rad recently. The reason for wanting these is that I bought a set brand new in Halfords bitd. Those were chrome and no one else had a set.

Here is the state of play of the project today; in primer because I do not know when I will be able to get it in to paint nor do I know if it will be powdered or sprayed. The original colour appears to have been a metallic blue over a very thin grey primer. At some point this was spayed over with a bright red and finally blow over white which only served to disguise areas of surface rust.

* P1010700.JPG (248.48 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 49 times.)


More soon I hope.
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2017, 02:10 PM »
Opps! Put in the wrong section.
Couls a mod. please move this to rest+tech, thank you
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline griff

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2017, 03:15 PM »
 :daumenhoch:
Radsters - get cash back on your online purchases ;) https://www.topcashback.co.uk/ref/griffington

Offline MartyC

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2017, 03:08 AM »
It shares the same tube set, lugs and jigs from Tange as the Scorpion, main difference between these (and the Malvern Star,  Apollo, KLM, etc.) are that Scorpion made their frames using Mangalloy whereas a lot of the others used high tensile steel and they were made in Chatsworth CA and not in Japan/Taiwan.

Out of curiosity how much does it weigh?  I have both a Scorpion TX frame and an almost identical Malvern Star frame and the weight difference is huge with the Malvern Star frame weighing much more than the Scorpion.  Also, Scorpion serial numbers are stamped on the seat post tube whereas the non Scorpion frames are stamped on the gusset, rear dropout or BB.


Better to crash and burn than fade away

Offline Mikku

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2017, 09:00 AM »
A great thread already! I love learning about the less common, more obscure bikes. :daumenhoch:

I also like and can entirely empathise with the opening comment:-

This is going to be a slow build but posting a thread helps with motivation, and I rather like posting, so here goes! It is also one of three projects I have on the go, not quite sure how that happened it sort of just did.

Will be following this one with interest!
From Dorset to Japan:- http://www.radbmx.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=182215.msg1828811#msg1828811
Ok riders, random start. Riders ready, watch the gate old guy on the Crupi!! :D

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2017, 08:00 PM »
During my research to track down this frame I came across around 20 brands all similar but different. Many sport identical Suntour style rear dropouts, many sport similar gussets etc. Of those 20 or so brands none were identical, it was infuriating the circles I went around trying to identify it!

I think the concensus for most of the brands is that they were probably Taiwan made by Merida or Giant or some other manufacturer to brand specific specifications. Some were Aussie made to simialr specs. Tange is often suggested for tube and lugg sets but I don't think there is anything concrete on this. Most brands were clearly for the far east market and Australasia.

Thanks for the input Radsters. MartyC, the lugged frame weighs 2.35 kg painted in primer compared to my Laserlite in chrome weighing 1.90 kg.
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline MartyC

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2017, 03:47 AM »
During my research to track down this frame I came across around 20 brands all similar but different. Many sport identical Suntour style rear dropouts, many sport similar gussets etc. Of those 20 or so brands none were identical, it was infuriating the circles I went around trying to identify it!

I think the concensus for most of the brands is that they were probably Taiwan made by Merida or Giant or some other manufacturer to brand specific specifications. Some were Aussie made to simialr specs. Tange is often suggested for tube and lugg sets but I don't think there is anything concrete on this. Most brands were clearly for the far east market and Australasia.

Thanks for the input Radsters. MartyC, the lugged frame weighs 2.35 kg painted in primer compared to my Laserlite in chrome weighing 1.90 kg.

All my previous research has pointed to it being almost certain that the tooling and lugs for these frames originate from Tange, see the article below about Scorpion...







Tange manufactured and supplied tubing, lug sets and tooling to bike manufacturers from the early 1970s, Apollo used the same lugs and tooling but Hi-Ten tubing and manufactured frames for a large number of companies.  in addition Malvern Star an Australian company used the same lugs and tooling, again using Hi-Ten steel tubing.  I found no information to indicate that either Merida or Giant ever manufactured BMX frames using the same lugs and tooling, they tended towards TIG welding not lugs.


Better to crash and burn than fade away

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2017, 10:36 AM »
Terrific article, thanks for posting.
I had read about the use of a ring of solder/bronze pre-inserted into the lugs before, I think in relation to some road bike manufacturers but I don't remember now. I guess I am being careful in this thread not to over-egg the Tange connection.
Something you may be able to shed more light on is the Madison Taipan Koizumi link up, just to confuse things even more!
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline BMX1973

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2017, 06:21 PM »
Interesting Frame sure it will turn out Rad  :daumenhoch:

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2017, 02:38 PM »
I picked up the frame from the powder coaters last week, a terrific job as always and at an unbelievably low price. I have seen some nasty powder jobs, drips and build up, obscuring all detail etc. I know paint would be better but a good powder coat job is getting close and good enough for me.

The blue, selected from a colour chart, is spot on for the look I am going for. I have struggled with this frame since I rather hastily bought it but I am on track now.

I thought I would bolt on what parts I had, to keep the bits together if nothing else. So here is a little update.
Tioga headset, Tourney caliper and Tange seat post clamp. The bike is starting to look like something....
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline Mikku

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2017, 07:43 AM »
Lovely colour that!
From Dorset to Japan:- http://www.radbmx.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=182215.msg1828811#msg1828811
Ok riders, random start. Riders ready, watch the gate old guy on the Crupi!! :D

Offline in2bmx

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2017, 09:29 AM »
Nice colour  :daumenhoch:

Offline Midschoolfool

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2017, 11:35 AM »
My powder coater will not be done on time. Kinda bummed, and hoping he isn't starting to dance.

Lovely colour though man. Very unusual frame too, can't get over how skinny those rear stays are lmao.

Offline NORTY40

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2017, 11:55 PM »
Looking forward to seeing how this turns out , nice colour too :daumenhoch:
WANTED : Old school BMX patches/sew on badges ......  please  :)

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2017, 04:13 PM »
I mentioned before that I had been struggling this frame, struggling for enthusiam to build it. I also mentioned that I had found a way to have some fun with it. Here it is, a tribute bike of sorts! I had a set of nos decals that the totally fantastic Delcals have duplicated. The quality of the decals is second to none, Delcals never cease to amaze me. This bike is going to get more Bobby like as I progress with the project.

* P1010832.JPG (363.01 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 50 times.)



* P1010833.JPG (263.71 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 31 times.)



* P1010834.JPG (264.85 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 39 times.)
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline Midschoolfool

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2017, 07:58 PM »
Fanny tastic.

Love the colour.

Offline CDBMX

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2017, 01:10 AM »
With some bars & a seat it will really start to look like a bike. I can clearly see the connexion with the Aussie Speedwell Sting, the Malvern Star Maxi & Supermax [which is what Nicole Kidman rode in 'BMX Bandits'] These all came from the same factory & used the same frame.

The downside was weight, the upside was strength & lower cost, so only the most dedicated cheap-arse bike abuser could ever do them much damage.

Go with your wild imaginings as there is nothing to lose. You'll have fun being unrestrained by a picture in a brochure telling you what parts to use.   :daumenhoch:

P.S
If I remember rightly, the three M/Stars that I had salvaged from an ugly fate all used a shim in the seat tube to accomodate a standard BMX 7/8" seat post, so if you find your 22.2mm post rattling around like a c*ck in a sock then don't stress, that's how they came.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2017, 01:18 AM by CDBMX »
I'll be building Quickies till the day I die, ..... & maybe a couple of days after that.

Offline Andyboy77

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2017, 01:25 AM »
Looks really nice! I'm a fan of this blue colour combined with chrome parts. Great effort  :daumenhoch:

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2017, 08:35 PM »
I bought a set of wheels of ebay recently for the build, thought I might get them cheap as they looked really scabby in the pictures: No such luck. Never mind. Although they did look very scruffy on close inspetion they were actually pretty nice. You had to look beyond the grime and knocks. Araya 7x, shimano DX hubs, nice.


* s-l1600.jpg (393.52 kB. 1422x800 - viewed 24 times.)



* P1010883.JPG (276.94 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 31 times.)



* P1010885.JPG (277.76 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 27 times.)


My plan was to make them into shiney sides, just clean them up, and later relace (I am going to have a go at this once I move to my new place).
« Last Edit: April 05, 2017, 08:38 PM by Avro »
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2017, 08:42 PM »
....Dismantled and scrubbed up, things were definatley looking up. Onto the shiney sides and I started with my palm sander with p80. I needed quite a few sheets until I was satisfied. Then onto p120 to p240 and finished with p400 wet and dry by hand. I am very pleased with the results. The wheels will be perfect for the build once, if, I manage to relace them.

Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline Quadog

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #21 on: April 05, 2017, 08:49 PM »
Great job on those rims 👍

Offline Avro

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Re: New build, going to be a slow!
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2017, 03:17 PM »
The Bobby bike moves on slowly. My newly anodised cranks and chainwheels are fitted, well chuffed with the blue I got. The bike was originally going to get a coaster, it still might, but I am not sure. I have not ridden a coaster since I was very, very young as they seemed to be popular on kids bikes back then. I am thinking that for a rider it might be quite fun?

Anyway, a little update:

* P1020103.JPG (236.27 kB. 1066x800 - viewed 22 times.)
Wanted: Tioga Rhino III (BIG TIME WANT) or Shimano 5000 frame set (Hattori Prosight)

Offline Midschoolfool

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Re: New build, something a bit different.
« Reply #23 on: October 18, 2017, 06:50 PM »
Nice rim job.. Well some one had to  :LolLolLolLol:

Nice work Avro. I am really liking this bike.
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Offline monkian

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Re: New build, something a bit different.
« Reply #24 on: October 19, 2017, 01:28 PM »
Great job on the wheels (I think I might have to do the same thing with mine when they land). It's all coming together nicely dude ;)
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