RADBMX.CO.UK
Technical & Reference Section => Tech and Restoration => Topic started by: simonm on October 23, 2008, 01:13 PM
-
Hi all,
After recently finding a pic of my old BMX I've managed to pick up a great condition Ammaco Team Sprint from Swivel on this board,
83/84 I think. Now I'm onto sourcing parts and looking for loads of help ! so any advice appreciated.
Firstly, sizes. I'm used to building modern MTB's but not used to BMX sizes, I measured the headtube and it appears to be 1" does that sound right ? Also Cranks,
there is a 2" hole for the crankset, seat post appears to be about 1 1/8" does that sound right ?
Secondly parts. Anyone have a list of parts that were originally used ? My guesses so
far from Pics / research are as follows, if you can update that would be great.
Wheels Alloy rims ARAYA ?
Tyres Comp III skinwall tyres ? Size ?
Stem SR 422 Stem blue !
Bars CP Bars ???
Grips Ammaco own ?
Cranks Mongoose one piece ? looks same as Mongoose wirewheel
Chainring
Pedals DX Style (Shimano) Pedals ?
Brakes Dual Alloy QR Brakes with Type III levers ?
Levers Dia Comp copy
Seat Ammaco Aero Saddle
Clamp SR SUNTOUR
Post What Diameter ?
HeadSet size / type ?
Many thanks in advance for your help.
-
Si mate, hi.
- I don't think they used Comp III's I believe they were copies also.
- The brakes were definitely copies too.
- Chainring was either Sugino or Stamped Ammaco (hard to find now)
- Bars, unknown but Tioga bars are very very similar, so are the Burner v-bars (I have an unchromed set you can have for next to nothing)
- Seat, deffo Ammaco stamped. Wasn't made by aero but was a copy.
- Headset, was a cheap headset, no name as such
- Grips, not sure
- I thought the stem was Suntour copy in Blue? I have an Ammaco stem in green that could be painted blue that you are welcome to.
- I have one of those Ammaco cranks with that Ammaco chain-wheel, contact me for pics.
I think that's it, or as much as I can remember ;)
Let me know if you need those other bits..
Matt :daumenhoch:
-
Si, if you need pics of all the Ammaco stuff I have to sell, LMK. I have some of what you require dude. I just realised I have the Ammaco copy MX brakes and levers in my garage also. They are green but could be stripped and painted blue? They came off my ammaco team pro around the same date.
Kind regards,
Matt :daumenhoch:
-
wow, thanks for all the info Matt. Feel cheeky downloading what must have taken you years to learn !
Intrested in the Ammaco Cranks / Chain wheel. Do you have a pic ?
Re-stem. In the catalouge i've found it listed as SR 422 stem - silver on all models I think.
Er to sound non internet savy, what does LMK mean ?
-
Ive sourced some levers, Brakes sound intresting.
-
wow, thanks for all the info Matt. Feel cheeky downloading what must have taken you years to learn !
Intrested in the Ammaco Cranks / Chain wheel. Do you have a pic ?
Re-stem. In the catalouge i've found it listed as SR 422 stem - silver on all models I think.
Er to sound non internet savy, what does LMK mean ?
LMK :- LET ME KNOW
:)
-
Doh of coarse it does :uglystupid2: must brush up on my TLA's
thanks all. Can;t wait to get this baby built up 8)
-
Matt / anyone,
Can you fill me in on the sizes.. headset, BB, seatpost.
ta.
-
HI MATE HEADSET IS 1", SEAT POST SHOULD BE 7/8" AND BB SHOULD BE A US STANDARD BMX BB. :daumenhoch:
-
Cool thanks for info.. 7/8ths. thats a funny old size... ta.
-
Hi Simon - don't know where your up to on your build mate but just thought i'd let you know that i have a set of ARAYA 7X in blue ano - they were NOS rims and hubs built up with new spokes but they have been ridden so have brake rub - the ano is mint on the inside of the rim still, and the hubs and spokes are mint - i was gonna polish the brake rub and make them shine sides as they'll look sweet with that done - also got a set of V bars that came off an ammaco - chrome is pitted so better to be re-chromed i think or maybe try an OA bath on 'em ? LMK if your interested in either and i'll fire some pics over to ya :daumenhoch:
-
yeh, V intrested. Fire the pics / price over please.
Cheers.
-
Will do bud - I'm in work at the mo but i'll get 'em over to ya tonight - I think i've got some blue comp 3 copy tyres as well if i remember rightly :daumenhoch:
-
aha... cool. look foreward to seeing pics.. ta.
-
Hi Simon
Well it was only a matter of time before I spotted a post about Ammaco bikes mate - I think Matt (Swivel) and me have owned them all in the past bud, so we can help.
Matt is your man when it comes to a historic true builds and knowledge, but I build mine how I'd have done them BITD (Back In The Day) if I'd have had a few quid more than my paper round and pocket money would let me stretch to. Back in 1982 my folks bought me an Ammaco 202 which was not a great bike let's face it. I flogged it in 1983 when I got a Mongoose Californian which got upgraded, raced and ridden off any ramp I could find, so my interest has always been building the bikes I had back then. Having done this, I upgraded them piece at a time and now I have these two examples:
1982 Ammaco 202 found NOS in a box in an old bike shop basement by my brother 9 years ago and my first build:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/aa149/Spen69/DSC00035.jpg)
Now it has Pro-Class wheels with GT intermediate tyres, DC MX900's with Tech3's, Tuff Neck stem and an Aero saddle. Whilst it rides a bit rubbish to be honest, I love it as it's how I wanted to build my original bike nearly 30 years ago, so I just ride it every now and then. I will NEVER sell this bike, especially as it has my original 1983 Pro-Class wheels on it that my dad kept in his shed when I put a set of Tuffs on my 'goose...... :smitten: :smitten:
1984 Ammaco Team Champion bought off here (cheers Wolfiehere :daumenhoch:) about a year ago:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/aa149/Spen69/DSC00037.jpg)
This bike is a bit more ridable and I ride it around racetracks for fun. It's got Araya 7X's in red with a Sugino 3-pc crank and new DC MX901 brakes. It's not a bad little toy and is light, despite the oversize tubes. I'll eventually sell this bike I'm sure, but I like it a lot right now and enjoy riding it like I stole it round tracks!
My advice is to build what you can afford. Ammaco were the poor man's Mongoose originally BITD, so the parts weren't top-notch but because f that, they are quite difficult to find decent ones. You often find you could get better parts for the kind of money you're paying to build the bike as it was from the factory, but the truth of the matter is the first thing we all did as kids was swap bits and upgrade your bikes when ever you could (or broke something :2funny:)
Finally, to help you get an idea of what your bike could look like, here's another bike I will never sell as it's a proper antique, my 1978 Team Mongoose. It's got blue Araya 7X's and blue Comp's on it, so I hope it helps inspire you to get the bike finished.
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/aa149/Spen69/DSC00038.jpg)
Most important thing about this site is it's full of idiots like me who refuse to grow up and love nothing better than to ride about on bikes far too small for them and simply don't care as we love it. Put a wanted add on the wanted pages for bits and people will help you no problem, but don't forget if you buy a 1980's Mongoose stamped crank, make sure you get the BB (Bottom Bracket) to fit it as they are a special thread that will cost a fortune to buy new if you have to :daumenhoch:
Post some pics when the buke's built mate and keep us posted on the progress.
Regards - Spen
-
Cheers for the comments Spen, you're a darling :-* :-* :-* ;)
Simon, i'll get up some pics today of the ammaco brakes, stem and crank. I'll post them on this thread. Then let me know what you're after. All came off the Team Pro and Team Sprint (another one I had).
Those ammaco v-bars that Bobafett sound good, and bloody rare also, so i'd grab those!
Speak soon,
Matt :daumenhoch:
P.S. and spen, that 1984 is fooking beautiful :smitten:
-
Morning Matt :2funny:
Do people not sleep on this website? At least I'm sat on a train heading up to Edinburgh so I'm bored and should really be working!
Let's see your Ammaco's then bud...... :coolsmiley:
Spen
-
;D Morning bud... :-* Well sold a few recently, only 2 x Team Pro's left (one basically NOS) and another Freestyler in the loft. I have this beauty built up which you've all seen before.... ;) Seat clamp has changed since these pics and the redline stem now has the correct sticker and the headset is being changed to an Epoch GT in Green next week :D
(http://www.swivuk.co.uk/radbmx-new/ammaco1.jpg)
(http://www.swivuk.co.uk/radbmx-new/ammaco2.jpg)
(http://www.swivuk.co.uk/radbmx-new/ammaco3.jpg)
(http://www.swivuk.co.uk/radbmx-new/ammaco4.jpg)
(http://www.swivuk.co.uk/radbmx-new/ammaco5.jpg)
(http://www.swivuk.co.uk/radbmx-new/ammaco8.jpg)
-
Cheers Matt / Spen. All good advice.. I missed that with the V-bars.. I'll re-read fets PM.
Cheers.
Dont suppose anyone wants to swap a black SR stem for a silver or blue one ?
-
Right then here's a pic of the bars cos i'm not an ammaco expert (if it ain't a goose i'm fooked ;D).
They came off an ammaco but i'll leave it to you guys to ID them :
(http://www.jpdeane.com/bmx/blue/bars1.jpg)
Also - swivel that stem you've got there on the green fella - you say its a redline ? Cool - i'm sure i've got this exact stem (came on a frame i bought) but i mistook it for a mongoose FS-1 stem - i was going to chuck it up in the for sale section as it's no use to me - i'll take a look at it again an see if it's the same - not bad condition, needs new bolts really as they are rusty, but the paint finish looks OK (grey i think) wht d'ya think its worth ???
-
Nice bars, deffo ammaco mate! Simon buy them now ;D
As for the redline stem, if its a proper one about £60 in a good condition, needs resto about £45 and a copy about £30. You can't really tell the difference with the copy at all mate to be honest, all look the same but some of the redlines are stamped and painted "REDLINE" at the front, some are not (like mine)
Cheers,
Matt :daumenhoch:
-
Si mate, hope you're well :)
If you want originality, then it needs a copy Suntour stem. I have an Ammaco one off a Team Sprint. I'll get some photos right now of the stuff for you.
Matt :daumenhoch:
Cheers Matt / Spen. All good advice.. I missed that with the V-bars.. I'll re-read fets PM.
Cheers.
Dont suppose anyone wants to swap a black SR stem for a silver or blue one ?
-
Cheers Matt,
BTW, Who else made V-Bars. These look like Ammaco... http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Kusuki-Alloy-Win-V-Bars-Blue-Oldschool-BMX-NOS_W0QQitemZ220301366970QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item220301366970 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Kusuki-Alloy-Win-V-Bars-Blue-Oldschool-BMX-NOS_W0QQitemZ220301366970QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item220301366970)
(http://idisk.mac.com/alanwoods1/Public/win-alloy-v-blue.jpg)
and these on feebay,
(http://i3.ebayimg.com/05/i/001/16/71/f3c6_1.JPG)
These ones look the closest... (My old bike had Blue bars - was trying to replicate that)
(http://i23.ebayimg.com/06/i/001/15/ce/c3e6_1.JPG)
I guess its the detail, how far down the V-Bar is mounted on each varies and compare to original.
here is my original bike,
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/Ammaco_WHAT+Small.jpg)
-
Si hi mate. All of them are not ammaco bars.
1st one - WinV bars. Alloy. All ammaco's were steel.
2nd one - looks cheap and nasty, v is too low down
3rd one - Wrong style and alloy also, incorrect for ammacos.
If you want blue, buy the correct bars, get them blasted and powdercoated, won't cost you more than £20.
Cheers,
Matt :daumenhoch:
Cheers Matt,
BTW, Who else made V-Bars. These look like Ammaco... http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Kusuki-Alloy-Win-V-Bars-Blue-Oldschool-BMX-NOS_W0QQitemZ220301366970QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item220301366970 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Kusuki-Alloy-Win-V-Bars-Blue-Oldschool-BMX-NOS_W0QQitemZ220301366970QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item220301366970)
(http://idisk.mac.com/alanwoods1/Public/win-alloy-v-blue.jpg)
and these on feebay,
(http://i3.ebayimg.com/05/i/001/16/71/f3c6_1.JPG)
These ones look the closest... (My old bike had Blue bars - was trying to replicate that)
(http://i23.ebayimg.com/06/i/001/15/ce/c3e6_1.JPG)
I guess its the detail, how far down the V-Bar is mounted on each varies and compare to original.
here is my original bike,
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/Ammaco_WHAT+Small.jpg)
-
BTW, checked on the third ones, they are steel... they look pretty close to me.... oooo ponders ponders ! BTW, if I powder coat they wont look the same blue as annodized kit would or dia compes. How do they get that look ?
-
Si, i'm certain the bottom ones (3rd) are alloy as I've had that style exactly in gold and red before. That's why that have that anodised look as they are alloy i'm sure.
Superbikedan can powder them in candy blue, to give them that anodised look :)
BTW, checked on the third ones, they are steel... they look pretty close to me.... oooo ponders ponders ! BTW, if I powder coat they wont look the same blue as annodized kit would or dia compes. How do they get that look ?
-
ahhh I C, ta matt..
-
Si morning mate. Ok here are the parts I was talking about. These are 100% genuine ammaco bits. You can see that the stem is a copy of the suntour stem, but is flatter on top and the crank looks like a Mongoose crank (with the shape of the chainwheel etc..). If you want these let me know, will be a tenner + postage, cheap as chips ;) Crank may need re-chroming but could polish up ok I guess, the chainwheel is in a good condition and the stem top could be painted Blue. I know they ain't big makes like suntour etc.. but at least they are genuine. Stem came off a Team Pro and the crank off the Team Sprint (the other one of mine which need a re-chrome unlike the one I sold to you... :) ).
Let me know...
Matt :daumenhoch:
P.S. Green pedals were added as I rode it for a bit ;)
(http://www.swivuk.co.uk/temp/ammacobits.jpg)
-
Hi mate,
Yeh, I'll take the Stem and cranks, there spot on m8. Whats total price your after inc P&P ?
ta
-
Ok mate, cool ;) I think for the weight, I reckon about £20 in total would do it?
Let me know...
Thanks,
Matt :daumenhoch:
Hi mate,
Yeh, I'll take the Stem and cranks, there spot on m8. Whats total price your after inc P&P ?
ta
-
yeh pretty heavy. Whats your paypal again ? will send ze fundz.. ta.
-
Cool, parts looking good. Learning as I go, must remember not to drink red wine then order a part that will "almost do" now i've got two handlebars that are no good ! O well, live and learn.
All I need now.. I think are brakes (someone may have some MX copies for me), Seatpost, Seat guts, Chain,..... and delivery of all the bits.. nice build project soon to commence. Now how do I hide the bike from the Mrs when its done ? I'm sure she'll notice a fourth bike in the garage !
-
Now how do I hide the bike from the Mrs when its done ?
Carefully take all your boxes as they arrive up to the attic pretending that you are sorting out some old crap - then take your tools up there and build it ;)
I've got shit loads up in my attic that she hasn't got a clue about - i just keep the riders downstairs :LolLolLolLol:
-
lmao ! attic...good idea 8)
-
All I need now.. I think are brakes (someone may have some MX copies for me), Seatpost
I think swiv ^^^^ has some blue DC 901's in one of his for sale post simon - no levers though :(
And what kind of seatpost are you after - i'm sure i can find something for you - are you gonna ride this when it's done ?
-
Pads arrived this morning thanks to firebird... they are FANTASTIC ! look like NOS.
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/Pads.jpg)
-
Si those pads are amazing :shocked:
-
o yes..tasty arnt they ! Picture doesnt do them justice either.
-
Yep - firebird is the master :smitten:
-
*turns on Irish accent* to be sure, to be sure, tou'ght I'd bring de up t'date with me build... looking good bejesush dont ye tink ?
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/ammacoprogress1.jpg)
mmm, hope I've not offended anyone ;) got carried away staring at the front...forgot to look at the back of the frame ;D
Honest, I've built my last 10 or more mountain bikes this was just a iccle slip in concentration !
BTW, As I've never built a BMX before. Is this right on the steerer tube ? There is quite a gap between the top screw cap and the lower bit...
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/ammacoprogress2.jpg)
-
I'd like to see you ride that Si :LolLolLolLol: :LolLolLolLol: :LolLolLolLol:
As for the gap mate i guess it depends on the length of the steerer tube on yer forks - you could cut it :shocked: :shocked: but have you definitely put all the parts of the headset on ? i.e. the bearing race on the forks before you inserted them into the headset tube and the locking washer with the little nobble in it before you put the locknut on ?
-
yeh, Crown race is on. But the washer (you can see) is above the lock ring at the moment, thats still going to leave about 5mm of thread exposed. Is that normal ?
-
yeh, Crown race is on. But the washer (you can see) is above the lock ring at the moment, thats still going to leave about 5mm of thread exposed. Is that normal ?
Not on any of me geese matey - all the lock nuts tighten right down - no tube thread showing. If you definitely have the bearing race on the forks then maybe the forks you've chosen just have a steerer tube thats too long for your headtube / headset arrangement - get your hacksaw out :-X
-
mmmm, will see what swivel says, frame and fork came together from him but I'm not sure if he ever had them together.
ta.
-
Si something don't look right here mate, are you sure all of the components of the headset went on? Never seen that where there is thread showing, looks like something is missing? Is the headset a cheapo from halfords or tange/tioga? In any case, it should all fit together nicely without any thread showing... ???
Also from looking up closely there, looks like the cups could do with being wacked in a bit more also Si ;)
Speak soon!
Matt :daumenhoch:
-
Will check tonight, I was rushing a bit to be honest (hence the upside down frame)... Whacking cups in ! I've got a nice peice of threaded rod with nuts and washers on to insert my cups :D
Yeh, its a cheepo headset.
-
Si try a piece of wood and give them a good belt or rubber mallet, I use both of those to get the cups in ok.
:daumenhoch:
-
Copy brakes sorted
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/b3a8_1.JPG)
-
Copy brakes sorted
Must be pretty close to having all of your bits for the build now eh Si ?
When are we gonna see some pics matey :coolsmiley:
-
yeh, front brake cable....and a few bits and bats and where there. Was hoping to have a bit of time at the weekend...unless I get my lard ass out riding (like I should be doing)...
-
yeh, front brake cable....and a few bits and bats and where there. Was hoping to have a bit of time at the weekend...unless I get my lard ass out riding (like I should be doing)...
Pray for rain and build the bike :daumenhoch:
-
It's all gone a bit quiet Si - what's happenin with the build ???
:LolLolLolLol:
-
Away in Denmark at moment till Friday... Cut the forks down, fitted them at the weekend, brakes fitted, considered how to polish sides of arraya rims, ordered polishing kit, considered how to get stooopid BB in to frame - left BB cups in Fridge on Sunday and forgot about them (still there now)... Got mind set on riding my DH bike at weekend so this could be a slooooowww process !
-
Away in Denmark at moment till Friday... Cut the forks down, fitted them at the weekend, brakes fitted, considered how to polish sides of arraya rims, ordered polishing kit, considered how to get stooopid BB in to frame - left BB cups in Fridge on Sunday and forgot about them (still there now)... Got mind set on riding my DH bike at weekend so this could be a slooooowww process !
LMAO :LolLolLolLol: :LolLolLolLol: :LolLolLolLol:
-
considered how to polish sides of arraya rims, ordered polishing kit
Si
Go to B&Q and buy yourself a cheap detail sander then use 180 grade then 240 paper on the rims. Bingo, job done in 10 mins fella :daumenhoch:
Spen
-
thanks Spen.
-
Had a go at one side of the rims. Sanded down with 80...then 280.. then polished with a kit off ebay. Not convinced I have the right compound, and the kit was dremmel type pads which I don;t think give good corage over the rim.. anyone and ideas ? From a distance there..ok... close up there patchy.
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/Rim1%20(2).JPG)
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/Rim1%20(3).JPG)
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/Rim1%20(4).JPG)
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/Rim1.JPG)
-
They look like they're getting there mate but a bit more elbow grease for that gleaming finish i reckon :-\
The guy who does all the alloy polishing restoration stuff over on vintagebmx.com (i forget his name) swears by a mouse palm sander - there is a whole big thread on there about it in the tech n resto area - worth a read i would say Si :daumenhoch:
-
Keep rubbin :D
-
ahhh, more effort required ! cheers though, mouse sander makes sense, good size for the rims. Anyone else have on of the ebay kits ? there is blue block of polish type stuff, when you use it though the rim goes black, then you have to buff it off with another pad... does that all sound right ?
-
Haven't seen that stuff Si - good old fashioned autosol is all you need i reckon ;)
-
Work in progress. Sussed the rims, came down to good prep, 80 grade, 260, 800 the buffing for ages with two grades of polsiher. look good now.
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/wip21-11-09%20(2).jpg)
-
Looks great mate
keep up the good work :daumenhoch:
Bob 8)
-
ta...the pads make it really.
(http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/BMX/wip21-11-09.jpg)
-
Nice one Si - she's comin together nice :coolsmiley:
I see you went with the blue bars ?
-
yeh, put them on at the moment, not had chance to clear up the silver ones yet.. Spent ages shining my rims :buck2:
Going to build it all up, if there is too much blue then I'll go with the silver.
-
Either way mate i think she'll look nice :daumenhoch:
-
Got the buy on Ebay to make up Ammaco stickers to go on my Dia Compe copies... look good.
(http://i10.ebayimg.com/03/i/001/1f/8a/3b16_1.JPG)
-
Got the buy on Ebay to make up Ammaco stickers to go on my Dia Compe copies... look good.
(http://i10.ebayimg.com/03/i/001/1f/8a/3b16_1.JPG)
Was that "cbrgil" AKA mark then Si ? Top bloke :daumenhoch:
-
yup ;)
-
mmm, came to stickin the seatpost on and I've got the wrong size clamp... anyone know the correct size for an ammaco ?
t.a
-
Must finish this off. Still got to get a 1" seatpost and a 1 1/8" clamp.. that size though strikes me as more new than the 1985/86 frame... is it an old standard ?
-
arghh ! I will finish this one day.. got a 25.4 post and... its about 2mm too tight.. what is it with this frame........
-
Some of the Ammaco fans on here should be able to point you in the right direction Si - but if not just use the post that's too thin and get a little shim made up ;)
-
Cannot see any of the photo's in this thread :(
-
I can see most, there are some missing on page 2
-
arggh ! my seatpost problem continues. Picked up a 25.4 (1") Haro post. Thats too large for the frame. Got a vernier, measured post - bank on 25.4, ID of my frame is strangley 24.6mm... Thats 1/32" less than an inch. I guess its possible that Ammaco made there own posts for a while and it was custom to there factory ?
-
pics of the finished bike...finally here...
http://www.radbmx.co.uk/forum/index.php'topic=95271.0